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Discussion point: “No, the government isn’t planning to introduce ID cards” One should aim to seek out good expositions of arguments with which one usually disagrees. I found an example via the UK Politics subreddit, this piece by James O’Malley: “No, the government isn’t planning to introduce ID cards”.
The article made me think slightly more kindly of the previous Conservative government and slightly less apprehensively about the plans of the new Labour government. Or have I been misled, and Labour’s resurrection of a failed Conservative policy is exactly as sinister as I always thought it was?
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The plans have been finalised. Therefore, the government is not planning to introduce ID cards.
The government will be planning to introduce ID cards, therefore it is not planning to introduce ID cards.
vs.
The government will ask Parliament to make it a criminal offence to propose, plan or introduce ID cards.
Of all the ways of dividing the world into two – there are the lanyard people and everyone else. The lanyard people wear ID cards on lanyards around their neck allowing access to the Parliamentary Estate, a business office, or minions who deliver public service. None of them can understand why others reject displays of minion-hood because who wouldn’t like to join the long march to Utopia?
And since the march to Utopia requires that people ‘resources’ can be farmed and managed for wrongthink accurately then ID cards are very popular with the Left. I rather expect Two Tier will shortly announce that we must all carry ID to discourage illegal immigration – an excuse looking for a justifying cause.
Also, there already exists an ID system and that is your passport. Not everybody has one of course but you’d think it would be easy enough for them to make a passport compulsory, or alternatively for the driving license to be extended to non-drivers with some additional information like immigration status.
What the UK doesn’t have is a unified register of the population, that then could be linked to an ID card.
To misquote Groucho Marx, I’m suspicious of any club that wants me as a member, and they can keep their damn lanyard. They might think I’d be valuable to them.
I carry photo I.D. and have done for many years – but people should not be forced to do so.
As for what the government is going to do about this matter – I do not know, but let us hope that Natalie is correct and they do not go down this road.
One point is that the British Welfare State, unlike that of say France (which is why migrants move on from France to the United Kingdom), is not really “insurance based” – people can get a wide variety of benefits, including health care, without proving they have “paid into” the system. Thus removing the need for I.D. cards. The American system is much the same – just turn up and claim Food Stamps (created by President Kennedy in 1961 – which in the minds of his Social Gospel supporters justified the rigged Presidential election of 1960), “Emergency” health care, and so on,
I doubt whether this system is financially, or culturally, sustainable – but then the French “insurance based” system is also a financial mess, indeed government spending and taxation is even higher in France than it is in the United Kingdom or the United States.
ID cards are sort of old hat. It’s cashless payments that is the new thing. And if that means using a smart phone then…
Well, apart from anything else means they can introduce “social credits”. You buy enough quinoa, you can get a beer!
I must admit that I thought electronic or ‘cashless payments’ were another step toward CBDC, but it seems it’s not, but there is a thrust to induce/coerce everyone to use cashless payments.
But it does not come from government, but the US transaction processors. Imagine being able to sit on your arse and take 2% of all economic activity in every economy in the West.
Ironically in the US identity cards in the form of drivers licenses (or state id cards for our less mobile friends) are to all intents and purposes compulsory. Many of the basic functions of life require you to have one. The government sets it up so that you can’t buy liquor, or cash a check, or enter a bar, or get on a plane, or rent an apartment, or open a bank account, get medical care or one of a bazillion other things. Oh yeah, or drive a car. However, one thing you can do without an id? Vote in an election. Because, apparently according to our overlords, black people are too stupid to get an id, and don’t need to do any of these other things that are required to live life.
The fact that it facilities large amounts of voter fraud is just an unfortunate consequence of this benign policy toward all those stupid people without a bank account, or who never buy a glass of wine, never drive a car, or certainly never get on a plane.
A while ago a friend of mine who lives in France was visiting and we were at the store buying some wine. For context, we were both in our late 30s at the time. The cashier asked for his id to prove he was old enough. She explained that company policy was that anyone who looked under 40 was to be carded for alcohol[*]. My French friend almost fell on the floor laughing.
Worst part of the story? I had to buy the wine. Fancy overpriced frenchie stuff too.
[*] Believe it or not this is extremely common in the USA, maybe even ubiquitous.
Fraser,
First time I ever bought booze in the USA I must have been 22. I had to show ID. My UK passport was seen as a little odd (this was in Atlanta, GA) and the cashier perused it a lot. My passport was issued by the office in Liverpool. She asked me if I knew the Beatles…
We don’t do “geography” or “history” here in the States. Since about 1975, we all major in “we suck.” You can tell this in a few moments of conversation with the average American. I’m sure most under-35’s think of England as a very small island off the Europe coast.
But don’t leave us hanging: Do you know them?
The lanyard people wear ID cards on lanyards around their neck allowing access to the Parliamentary Estate, a business office, or minions who deliver public service. None of them can understand why others reject displays of minion-hood because who wouldn’t like to join the long march to Utopia?
I work in a bank, and you are told to remove your lanyard id in case some anti-fascist nut case decides to take pity on you, so in fact the lanyard people, who proudly wear theirs everywhere, are oblivious to the normies who are impacted by their open door policies.
When 2TK wants to protect “us” from the “far right” it’s a fantasy, most of us, including Taylor swift fans and people who walk across London Bridge every day, don’t think it’s the “far right” who pose a problem.
This. I was talking to the man who runs my local paper shop recently, they pay the card companies 50p per transaction!
The beauty of cash is that it circulates, but with digital transactions it eventually all accumulates in Visa/Mastercard/Amex’s pockets
NickM – yes and the “digital money” scam is being pushed all over the world, as far away as Thailand.
“Here is a basic income of X per week or month – but the government and partner-corporations can decide when it must be spent and what it must be spent on”.
The final collapse of what is left of free enterprise – and its replacement by a Klaus Schwab (WEF and United Nations) style Corporate State of “Stakeholder Capitalism” – controlled by international governance, the Credit Bubble banks, and other vast Corporations.
Why bother pleasing customers – when you can control their income and make them buy your good and services.
Entertainment? The latest “Woke” films and television shows – or NOTHING.
Food? The “plant based”, chemical filled, muck they have planned for us all.
And-so-on.
bobby,
There wasn’t a queue behind me so I could’ve concocted some cock and bull story about how Paul once pranged my Dad’s car and… But I didn’t and still couldn’t. Alas I do not know the Beatles. I did go to school with a lad whose uncle was Davy Jones from the Monkees but that is not quite the same, is it?
Oh, and a Great, great… whatever of mine was buggered by Lord Byron – probably.
Why on earth would the Left want to introduce ID cards? The only real value in them is to enable things they are dead set against – securing our borders, controlling access to benefits, preventing people who are not supposed to be here from accessing public services, fighting crime etc etc etc. The whole point of ID cards is to disadvantage people who are not supposed to be in the country, and to allow easier identification and tracking of criminals, both of which are anathema to the Left. Think of the fuss from the usual suspects that mandating voters ID has caused. And if you aren’t going to utilise the benefits that ID cards might offer – restricting access to benefits and government services to those not entitled to them, fighting crime, what is the point of spending all that money? What else can you get from ID cards that would further Leftist aims?
Andy,
Excellent point. There is no way I’m gonna buy a can of Coke from my local newsagent with a card.
I was talking to the man who runs my local paper shop recently, they pay the card companies 50p per transaction!
That would be for online transactions, a point of sale using contactless or chip and pin payment is normally a flat rate, like 2%.
Runcie,
Apart from your dubious deinition of “a flat rate”* this is, whether a fixed charge or a percentage a massive problem for small retailers of small goods. Yesterday I spent 600 quid on computer parts from one big company online. By card, obviously. No big deal. I also went out and took photos and as it was a hot day bought a Coke from a little shop. 5x20p coins. Even if it is 2% for a card that is a big deal. Yeah, I know, I brought-up the whole “Big Brother” malarkey wrt mandatory card payments but it is very nasty for small traders.
*I’m thinking of tax here as an example. A flat rate of income tax might be, say, 25% on any earnings over 30K. No NI (which is a twisted fiction anyway) and no “progressive taxation.
NickM
Part of the point of digital money is to wipe out independently owned small business enterprises. To give total economic dominance to governments and partner Corporations.
As far as the international establishment are concerned – it is not a bug, it is a feature.
Paul,
I know that. They hate small business. They hate them because small business owners are more likely to be on the right over many things. Why? They run on tight margins. They tend to be sole-traders or family affairs and therefore don’t “create” jobs. Every politico (of every shade) loves big business setting-up because they can say “I helped bring x-thousand jobs to the area”. Your local corner shop doesn’t do that does it? Where I live the mass destruction of small shops is dreadful. The latest was the local hardware shop. Now it wasn’t cheap but if I needed a few odds and ends it was convenient and (if you factor in travel) quicker and cheaper than going to B&Q. Oh, and Gary, the sole-proprietor and only worker, knew his stuff and he had a friendly dog.
OK, I know this is OT but… Am I the only one finding reCAPTCHA is getting to be even more of a pain in the arse? Yes, I know why you guys have it. I’m just saying that I spent longer spotting fire hydrants than I did writing my last comment. Just sayin’.
NickM – I think it is a broader matter (although, yes, the points you make are correct), the international establishment have certain plans for how the wish society to be, and independently owned small business enterprises, including family farms, do not fit into those plans.
It is not just a few people meeting in Davos (or where ever) these plans have gone right down the pecking order of the establishment – down to the local level. Agenda 21, Agenda 2030, and all that.
The plan is for the future is to be controlled by government and partner corporations – and it will not be a future worth living in.
Credit Money, and those who create it from nothing, is also part of this – as it, along with the endless taxes and regulations, helps to concentrate the economy in a few hands.
Once the economy is concentrated – then people are easy to control, in every aspect of their lives.
In America Harris/Walz (or rather the forces that control them) are very much on board with this totalitarian agenda – for totalitarian it is.
a massive problem for small retailers of small goods
It’s a service, and most providers will negotiate for bulk transactions as it is quite a competitive market, 2% compares with PayPal etc.
Banks charge for small change deposits, granted it’s not as high as 2% but maybe worth it for some retailers.